With regards to my previous post, concerning the military attack on the two gas pipelines in the Baltic sea, I think that a fifth grade boy would understand that Russia and the EU couldn't be interested in hitting their own underwater infrastructure. And the same boy would also understand that other world powers may be interested in a neverending war in East Europe, from East Ukraine to the Baltic sea.
As it is known, the Russian company Gazprom owns 51% of the Nord Stream pipelines, with EU countries holding the remaining 49%. So we can easily make the first step of an investigation, which means that the two owners, Russia and the EU, couldn't be interested in destroying their own underwater infrastructure.
Since the world noticed the attack on the two gas pipelines, journalists, bloggers and normal people haven't been talking about the author of the sabotage, although everybody knows that there were military ships close to the point of the explosions. They have mentioned the damage from an environmental point of view and the rising price of gas. But they are all afraid of saying or writing something about the government that planned the attack. Silence! Although journalists and bloggers understand exactly who planned the attack. That's typical of authoritarianism!
Unfortunately, hitting underwater infrastructures may become a new way of fighting a war. And in this perspective, the problem is that there are many undersea fiber optic cables and electrical grid pipes, which stretch across the world from one country to another through oceans and seas. I hope that these underwater infrastructures do not become new military targets.
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ReplyDeleteI hope not too. It would be the darkness even in real life not only in our lives. Fear and chaos everywhere. Oh no, I don't wanna think about it. Please if I make mistakes with my English tell it, I swear I won't be upset (Why should I?)
PS: Your blog is very interesting too.
PS2 Sorry for the deleted comments, I made typing mistakes.
Thank your for the appreciation, Daniele!
DeleteUnfortunately, there are no doubts: it was a military attack. And this means there are other countries involved in the war.
So we can say that one of our worst nightmares has come true.
DeleteI hope it is not too late.
DeleteMeanwhile, I have just heard that the investigation of the damages on the crime scene, conducted by the Swedish Security Service, can conclude that there have been detonations at Nord Stream 1 and 2 in the Swedish economic zone that have caused extensive damage to gas pipelines. More interesting is that the police also said they had seized some material during their probe that would now be analysed.
I think that investigation should be made by Swedish, German and Russian officers all together, as detectors shouldn't hide evidence.
https://wincountry.com/2022/10/06/swedish-police-investigation-of-nord-stream-leaks-strengthens-suspicion-of-gross-sabotage/
Very interesting. Thank you for the link. Yes, Russia Sweden and Germany to investigate, sure not USA or other countries connected with USA and their positions about Ukraine war tout court.
DeleteHi Giorgio!
ReplyDeleteGiorgio full agreement, but what he did a few days ago, what he wrote on Twitter, former Polish Foreign Minister R. Sikorski, now a member of the European Parliament is unimaginable stupidity!
Maybe Mr. Sikorski has got some evidence ... he knows some military ships were there.
Delete...war is always a messy business.
ReplyDeleteBusiness is the right word, unfortunately. This war hasn't gone to an end yet, because some countries are involved in selling weapons and anti-missiles systems. The countries that support values of democracy and respect for human rights have not interest in negotiations.
DeleteThe explosion of gas pipelines is a real act of terrorism. It was beneficial to only one country - the United States of America.
ReplyDeleteI think in a period of time during which a war is being fought there isn't any difference between act of terrorism and military operation. They are coordinated military actions of a state, or a non-state actor, in response to a developing situation.
Delete... since the war began in late February, in addition to Russia, Ukraine and Belarus, there have been some other belligerents.
DeleteGiorgio, I don't agree with you. First, Germany and other EU countries receive gas from these turbines. Is Germany also at war with the US?
DeleteSecondly, why are the Americans again accusing us of their crimes? Soon they will drop a nuclear bomb and say that Russia dropped the bomb on itself. Are we shooting ourselves again? Russia is not a country of suicides. Russia is not a country of madmen.
Il gasdotto trasporta metano dalla Russia all'Europa. Chi veramente è danneggiato deve individuarsi nel Paese che non riceve più gas, cioè l'Europa. Chi è tenuto a inviare gas, la Russia, e non volesse farlo più senza pagare penali per il mancato rispetto dei contratti da rispettare, l'unico modo per uscire dal pasticcio è danneggiare irrimediabilmente il gasdotto.
ReplyDeleteAnche questa potrebbe essere una lettura di quanto accaduto, che però al momento non ha alcun riscontro probatorio. Inoltre, sarebbe opportuno visionare gli atti contrattuali inerenti la fornitura del gas, considerato che tale contrattualistica internazionale spesso prevede clausole che esimono da qualsiasi responsabilità la parte inadempiente nel caso di eventi bellici che possono dare luogo all'emanazione di sanzioni economiche e altre misure analoghe. In quest'ottica, la compagnia statale russa, Gazprom, era già scevra da responsabilità a seguito dell'omessa fornitura delle turbine in riparazione in Canada. Anche in quest'ultima situazione non ha senso parlare di penali contrattuali in capo alla società canadese, considerato il subentrare di una causa di forza maggiore (sanzioni economiche verso la Russia).
DeleteComunque tutto e il contrario di tutto è possibile.
Condivido le tue osservazioni.
ReplyDeleteHo cercato di capire utilizzando *"cui prodest*
Gus, per qualche ragione, l'aggressione dell'Ucraina nel 2014-2022 contro il Donbass non ti ha mai interessato.
ReplyDeleteLa Russia ha perso grandi quantità di gas e miliardi di dollari. Potremmo continuare a vendere il gas di questi gasdotti ai paesi dell'UE.
I gasdotti sono molto difficili da far saltare in aria. Non possono essere fatti saltare in aria in un giorno. I tubi sono in acciaio, ma avvolti da uno spesso strato di cemento. I tubi si trovano sul fondo del Mar Baltico e sono ricoperti di terra.
Navi americane sono state viste in quest'area per diversi giorni.
Il Donbass è all'interno dei confini dell'Ucraina, e anche se è abitato da russi ciò non toglie che deve rispettare le decisioni del governo di Kiev.
ReplyDeleteL'Ucraina è un Paese povero e una moltitudine di persone si è rifugiata all'Estero per sopravvivere. L'operazione militare della Russia in questi ultimi tempi ha causato la morte di sei milioni di civili.
Irina, io ti voglio bene come persona e credo che non sia informata dei fatti dato che la Russia è una dittatura che ha ritagliato anche la rete, e basta una protesta per ricevere una condanna di sette mesi di carcere.
Non creare inutili discussioni su un blog con admin Giorgio e che tratta di problematiche diverse.
To Gus & Irina:
ReplyDeleteanche se conosco entrambi voi da poco tempo, posso comunque ritenere che siete due persone in grado di confrontarvi utilizzando toni e contenuti che rendono interessante la discussione.
Vorrei solo ricordarvi che non é facile essere precisi su un tema del genere, viste le difficoltà nel reperire informazioni certe riguardo ad eventi, numeri e responsabilità.
Penso che si può comunque partire da un punto indiscutibile, che sul piano del diritto internazionale consiste nella lesione della sovranità territoriale. Ma andando via via all'indietro ci sono sempre meno dati certi. Per cui non é un lavoretto di poche righe riassuntive.
Lungi da me volervi dare lezioni di qualsiasi tipo.
Un caro saluto
Il Donbass dovrebbe rispettare le decisioni del governo ucraino? Gus, mi stai prendendo in giro?
ReplyDeleteLa decisione del governo ucraino è di uccidere tutte le persone che vivono nel Donbass.
Gus, tu non capisci niente di Russia o Ucraina. Zelensky ha rilasciato una licenza a mercenari provenienti da Polonia, Gran Bretagna, Stati Uniti per bombardare gli abitanti di Donbass, Kherson, Zaporozhye...
I leader dell'UE urlano da anni che la Russia ha usato il suo gas come arma. Abbiamo distrutto le nostre armi noi stessi? Non siamo pazzi!
ReplyDeletewar getting more and more insane.... very sad.
ReplyDeleteI've heard that many experts and people on the ground say the next two weeks are quite crucial ... the weather temperatures are getting quite cold, and I sorry to see that any kind of negotiated end to this war seems completely out of the table.
DeleteDopo le elezioni per arrivare a un Presidente del consiglio, quindi un governo, i tempi sono lunghissimi.
DeleteL'Italia ha bisogno di gas anche usando il carbone e rigassificatori. Questi ritardi sono inaccettabili. La fine della guerra potrebbe contribuire ad abbassare i prezzi dell'energia, ma sul metano russo non bisogna più contarci. L'Europa ha scelto di abbattere la dipendenza da Gazprom.
... if Ukraine & Russia were to agree on any kind of negotiated end of this war, gas & oil prices would decrease sharply. This is a fact, as the world commodities market discounts anything.
DeleteAt the moment some EU landlocked countries are reliant on Gazprom for energy supply, due to the fact that their foreign gas is almost entirely supplied by Gazprom.
Anyway, over the medium term this will not be a problem, as there are gas pipelines under construction, planned or proposed. New oil and gas pipelines from the Caucasus, Central Asia, and the Middle East will reduce EU's energy dependance on Gazprom.
Hope next Winter will not be as cold as it normally should :-)
It's true that today wars are fought differently and for different purposes.
ReplyDeleteRight! Actually, on February 18, 2022, five days before the beginning of the Russian invasion of Ukraine, an explosion of a Russian gas pipeline was reported in Verhunka (Ukraine), near Luhansk. The explosion has interrupted the gas delivery to Ukraine, Belarus, Poland, Hungary, Slovakia, the Czech Republic and Germany. Ukraine and Russia accused each other of causing the sabotage.
DeleteTen days before the explosion of the Russian pipeline, exactly on February 8, 2022, USA President said: “If Russia invades, that means tanks and troops crossing the border of Ukraine again, then there will be no longer a Nord Stream 2,” Biden said. “We will bring an end to it.".
Obviously this is not a proof! But it shows us how wars have been fought differently, as you mentioned.
Thank you for sharing your point of view :-)
https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/world/2022/february/biden-threatens-no-gas-pipeline-if-russia-invades-ukraine
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