In a desperate attempt to distract the rest of the world, the USA now blame the Ukrainians for the attack on the Nord Stream pipelines, which carried gas from Russia to Northern Europe (1). But according to the New York Times, there is no evidence about who is to blame, "from Moscow to Kyiv and from Washington to London"(2). In addition, the New York Times cites anonymous US intelligence officials.
As it is known, Ukraine and some allies have opposed the project for years, due to the fact that the pipelines may be a national security threat. Obviously this is not an evidence. But how can be the Nord Stream's owners involved in the sabotage? In this context, some experts put the cost of repairing the pipelines starting at about $ 500 million (3). That's the main raison why the two main Nord Stream Owners, Russia and Germany, couldn't been interested in destroying their own pipelines.
Ukraine has denied any involvement in September's attack on the Nord Stream pipelines .
(1) Photo released by the Danish Military in September 2022
(2) https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-03-08/ukraine-group-nord-stream-attack-intelligence-report/102066980
(3) https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/07/us/politics/nord-stream-pipeline-sabotage-ukraine.html
...will the truth come out?
ReplyDeleteA full investigation will not take place. Actually, we are not talking about trial, legal prosecution or international crime. This an act ot war.
DeleteReplyDelete
Hari OM
ReplyDeletePlease be very careful; the news is NOT that there is Ukranian involvement (even if the USA would like to point fingers). The investigation by German, Danish and Swedish teams has reason now to believe that a yacht was used that is owned by Ukranians, but sailed out of Poland, but those investigators are at pains to make clear there can be no allocation of fault as yet. Boris Pistorius warns against drawing any conclusions on this partial evidence.
Germany's foreign minister and Jens Stoltenberg also call for commonsense and to await completion of investigation.
The ABC report simply reiterates the lack of confirmed 'proof'; the NYT is behind a paywall, so useless for readers not prepared to subscribe there.
I make no defence of any state, neither condemn. Let the evidence be worked and then comment... YAM xx
Try to understand why the USA "would like to point fingers", as you mentioned. It is not necessary to be careful, due to the fact that I am simply trying to understand the reason why the USA could be so interested in such news about the hypotetical Ukrainian involvement.
DeleteI noticed that some people don't like to think about this sabotage ... as they are waiting for evidence. In the meanwhile, it seems they are afraid they are not enabled to think. Not to mention that it's easy to see that we will never have any evidence.
If you were to read my short and clear post, you would see that I have stressed many times that there isn't any evidence yet. Consequently, it not necessary to talk about caution.
You said NYT is behind a paywall. It seems you're learning now about payment barriers that publishers set up for select online offers.
Two things are important: evidence and reasoning. And reasoning has nothing to do with blaming someone.
Hari OM
Delete...but there IS some evidence per the German report; the Polish charter yacht from a firm owned by two Ukrainians. It was also established that the passports used for hiring the yacht were 'expert forgeries'. This, it seems was enough for the "intelligence" to get overworked. If this much as been found, allow the research to continue and yet more will be revealed.
I agree, the Americans have jumped the gun with supposition. Your 'short and clear post' was little more than a reiteration of what the media has put out. What purpose does this serve? You talk of reasoning, yet what reasoning have you actually added here?
Reasoning says that the investigating states have had a breakthrough and no doubt will continue with the same determination. The truth will come. With nothing else to go on, everything else is supposition. Your response to Irina below concerns me... if (God forbid) you found yourself being investigated by police for an act of sabotage, would you want the rest of the world to be making up their own version of events, or would you prefer the forensic process of the official investigators to reveal your innocence or guilt? (Of course, if guilty, you might find ways to obfuscate the process - but forensics, hard science and logic, wins every time.)
I enjoy debate and am even happy to agree to disagree - but will not entertain conspiratorialisms and the spreading of half-truths. Yxx
Hello,
DeleteI am not making any investigation, as I am not on the ground. And if I had some evidence, I wouldn't show them on a blog or a newspaper. I mean that some hypothetical evidence would be useful for the prosecutor.
You didn't see any reasoning in my post? As I already mentioned above, this means that you didn't read the post ... I wrote that, in my opinion, the Nord Stream's owners couldn't be involved in the sabotage, considering that some experts "put the cost of repairing the pipelines starting at about $ 500 million". Sorry to see you don't understand any reasoning.
I also agree on sharing our point of view.
Have a nice time,
G
I believe Seymour Hersh. He is an honest man and a talented journalist. USA is an empire of lies. They lie all the time.
ReplyDeleteThe Kyiv regime also constantly lies.
This year, the Ukrainian Nazis are constantly committing terrorist acts in the territories of Russia and Belarus. On March 2, in the Bryansk region, they attacked a car in which three children were driving to school in the morning. A 10-year-old boy was seriously injured.
It is strange that the Americans blamed Ukraine. Why didn't they think about aliens?
ReplyDeleteAfter all, Biden said that the balloons over the United States were alien ships.
As I mentioned, it may be a desperate attempt to distract the rest of the world. But according to the mainstream brainwashing system, we can't think anything unless any evidence. Consequently, we can't think about this topic as we will never have any evidence.
DeleteThe question is: if an American pipeline or power grid were to be hitten, we would be enabled to think about a hypotetical responsible without any evidence? I think we could!
No investigation will ever take place. Because the US knows they blew up the pipelines. The investigation is prohibited.
DeleteHow can some people be so naive or hypocritical? We will never see any evidence, as we are not talking about trial or legal prosecution. This is a war!
DeleteIn addition, as mentioned by Roentare, by that time, people would have lost the interest in this act of war.
Giorgio scared me today with the news, which I read after waking up and „told me” - "good morning".
ReplyDeleteI read in the headlines that a power plant in Zaporizhia was threatened as a result of the shelling. Thank God (I read in the afternoon) that the emergency with the power supply has been repaired.
I heard yesterday about a fire that started at the Zaporizhzhia power plant, as it was shelled by Russians. It seems reactors were not affected. Another power plant was hit in Lviv.
DeleteGive it another few years, the full investigation will take place. By that time, people would have lost the interest in it
ReplyDeleteExactly, my friend! But people don't understand this point!
DeleteYes it's true, no evidence against Ukraine, but it sounds strange that USA admit that "someone" near Ukraine did this attack. Not so strange if the attack was made by USA, but I'm wondering : cui prodest?
ReplyDeleteThat's an interesting question, Daniele.
DeleteAt the moment I can simply see that some EU countries can't buy cheap Russian gas and oil. Consequently, those USA's satellites and puppets are compelled to buy more expensive gas elsewhere. This is a fact.
I agree with Roentare with regards to waiting for findings and evidence, as by that time, people would have lost the interest in it. Unfortunately, I see some people who don't want to make any hypotesis ... they naively (or hypocritically) are waiting for evidence to be worked. But which findings are they talking about? ... they pretend not to understand that we will never see any evidence. We are not talking about trial or legal prosecution: this is a war.
Thank you for sharing your interesting reasoning, Daniele.
Buona giornata nonostante le brutte notizie!
ReplyDeleteThank you!
DeleteHave a nice day :-)